SecureCon, SciPy, Gaming/Blade Runner

[tcpip]

Gave my presentation at SecureCon yesterday. PDF of the slides available, notes coming soon. The medieval castle metaphor does work particularly well for network security; also caught up with catsidhe who was present. Unfortuntely have not been able to attend today, but have successfully fixed an install of NumPy and SciPy, which required some annoying modifications to the code.

This Sunday I start the アイヌ語のラットの伝説 game. Tonight playing Polaris, last night D&D 'Ralia where my wide-eyed Hobbit continues to play the idiot savant. Tomorrow expecting some more gaming goodness with imajica_lj, kremmen, hathhalla, ser_pounce all making appearances before we head to the Astor to see Blade Runner, the Final Cut.

Ahem: I'm a goose; that's next Saturday which of course I'm booked with severina_242 and _zombiemonkey. Better fix that..

Yesterday slotted in another three scenes to my online HeroQuest Glorantha game. Have also completed a review of a classic RuneQuest/Judges Guild module, Broken Tree Inn on rpg.net

I've been saying this for years: Without Words there are no concepts (from hasimir via flemco). 8 limbed girl has operation. A blunt and pithy assessment of the economic claims in the Australian election. Howard on being sorry, and keeping wages down. News just in: Howard heckled with 'scumbag' taunts.

Comments

[zey.livejournal.com]

There was a comment on the interest rates apology from someone at Crikey:

Media coverage of Prime Minister John Howard saying “sorry” for interest rate rises was seized upon by the Opposition yesterday. More fool them. The PM later sprung his trap, revealing that when he said "sorry", it wasn't actually an apology!

At some point, the ALP needs to start taking the piss out of Howard using clips of The Fonz from Happy Days doing his "Surr-ruuh... Suh-ruuh..." thing. Happy Days was always meant to be a comedy, but, Howard's beyond a joke these days and his weasel-words have become a self-parody.

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

Ridicule is a powerful weapon (as Keating often showed). Rudd however doesn't have the demeanor to use it.

The Party does need a front-bencher who is capable of such commentary.

[zey.livejournal.com]

Even someone with a sense of humour contributing to their advertising wouldn't go astray :-).

[laptop006.livejournal.com]

On the way back from a job last night we saw a politial ad with a photo of Howard and the text "Australian working families have never been better off"; the rest of the ride home we tried to figure out if it was a Liberal or ALP ad. (Still no idea)

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

The ALP isn't that subtle :-).

Hey, what are you doing with that mountain of money you have in Warbook?

[roadriverrail.livejournal.com]

Without Words there are no concepts

Having read a fair slice of psycholinguistics (for an amateur), I was so on board with this article until it got to DMT and UFOs.

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

Yes; but that part of it is quite incidental; it seems like the author is combining interests. Although as pure speculation, language seems to heavily mediated by closeness of species so any genuinely alien communication would be difficult..

[jeshyr]

This is incidentally the thing that bugs me most about much SF.

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

*nods* Me to. Aliens, and especially the humanoid variety, are usually presented as some sort of human cultural stereotype rather than being genuinely alien.

[evil-genius.livejournal.com]

you have got to let me bang some stuff out for you in Visio some time.

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

Hey that would be pretty cool.... I'm not a particularly graphics intensive user, but I know Visio is one of the best things MS has going for it these days...

[evil-genius.livejournal.com]

Well they have managed to pervert it quite completely from it's original HIGHLY USABLE 2000 version(which was little more than a repacking purchase they had recently made). But with enough swearing and screaming one can generating some fairly shocking stuff with it.

www.ratemynetworkdiagram.com/

Is just full of stuff people have banged out with it.

Check these out aswell:
http://www.cenic.net/operations/documentation/CENIC-Design.jpg
http://www.cisco.com/iam/unified/ipt1/images/04implem-13.jpg
http://www.bvisual.net/images/WorldCom%20-%20Auto%20network.gif

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

Yeah, ratemynetwork is one of my favourite sites..

I've discovered a whole bunch of near-Visio options in the FOSS world as well..

http://www.webservertalk.com/archive291-2005-6-986650.html

[evil-genius.livejournal.com]

Oh indeed there is a small army of them available. I've unfortunately found some absolutely killer capabilities that Visio has that no other single piece(or easily integrable group of) software has.

More on that in a few weeks.
(you are going to love this... er rather hate that no OSS has the same capabilities yet)

[crooked7.livejournal.com]

Hey, way off topic. But are you interested in taking a Marxian Economics class starting in January. The course is online and offered by the University of Utah, the professor allows outside observers to participate in the class. And best of all it's free.

Doesn't that sound like a sales pitch?

The text for the course is available online, check it out.
http://www.econ.utah.edu/~ehrbar/akmk.pdf

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

Count me in. Marxist economics is something I enjoy engaging with,,,

That's a pretty comprehensive text!

[crooked7.livejournal.com]

Great, I’ll get back to you closer to January

I started an online community this semester for a few online friends that were observing the class. You are more than welcome to join.
http://community.livejournal.com/marxian_econ/

Also you can contact (Hans) the professor at
ehrbar@economics.utah.edu

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

OK, joined. I'll send the Prof an email post-haste as well..

[crooked7.livejournal.com]

My name is Brandon btw, just tell him I referred you.

babel

[decrypt-era.livejournal.com]

without words there are no concepts

Th first time i heard you say this was in 92, thereabouts,
and in all th time since,
u'v never said anything which persuaded me
that this notion is anything other than utter bollocks.

A label for a concept is not th thing conceivd.
I have many thoughts which aren't attachd to words.
Language is a subset of thought.
Mostly a mind to mind transmission codec,
and hell lossy to boot.
Th loopback function, tho, has seen a lot of use of late,
perhaps a sign of madness?

Re: babel

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

Doesn't the article itself provide any justification to you of the concept? The study showed, quite conclusively imo, that "a people without terms for numbers doesn't develop the ability to determine exact numbers."

What of the ancient western Celts, who had a concept for a colour that was sort of blue, sort of green and sort of grey? What is the colour of the North Atlantic, crashing upon the shoreline?

I know what it is. I have the concept, because I have a shared symbolic value with others on this matter.

Consciousness, as the etymology of the word indicates and as use was for hundreds of years (prior to Descarte) means 'shared knowledge'.

Re: babel

[amazinggoatgirl.livejournal.com]

The study showed, quite conclusively imo, that "a people without terms for numbers doesn't develop the ability to determine exact numbers."

Ok, so they don't have words for numbers and they don't have math. Why does that mean that without words, they didn't develop the concepts? Couldn't it just be that they never had a reason or desire to talk or think about numbers?

Consciousness, as the etymology of the word indicates and as use was for hundreds of years (prior to Descarte) means 'shared knowledge'.

So then you're defining 'concept' as a unit of knowledge that more than one person knows, that can be communicated? Do you separate this from the concept of a 'thought?' If so, isn't that kind of circular?

I agree that it's easier to think about something that has a name. I don't think it's impossible to think about it without one, though. Can't you just use your own placeholder names? Like if I was thinking about something that I didn't know any name for, in my head I could just call it 'that-thing-you-were-thinking-about-last-Tuesday.'

+

[amazinggoatgirl.livejournal.com]

(We had a discussion about this study in language psych and decided that if the researcher had gone up to members of that tribe with a big bag of fruit and said, "Here, take fruit for each of your family members," and watched them divide it up to see if it would be divvied up according to some kind of serving size or at least that everyone got some and they couldn't even do that, then we would be much more convinced.)

Re: +

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

From Wikipedia:

"The Pirahã do not count with numerals. They use only approximate measures, and in tests were unable to consistently distinguish between a group of four objects and a similarly-arranged group of five objects. When asked to duplicate groups of objects, they duplicate the number correctly on average, but almost never get the number exactly in a single trial."

Re: babel

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

Why does that mean that without words, they didn't develop the concepts? Couldn't it just be that they never had a reason or desire to talk or think about numbers?

Those two comments are not necessarily in contradiction, however it seems that despite many attempts to teach numbers they just don't "get it".

http://www.pnglanguages.org/americas/brasil/PUBLCNS/ANTHRO/PHGrCult.pdf


So then you're defining 'concept' as a unit of knowledge that more than one person knows, that can be communicated? Do you separate this from the concept of a 'thought?' If so, isn't that kind of circular?

"Thought" implies the cognitive capacity to model, which also requires consciousness and concepts. It is distinct to what Chalmers (1996) referred to as "Phenomenal consciousness" (P-consciousness) is simply mental experience.

words both free and trap us

[decrypt-era.livejournal.com]

Doesn't the article itself provide any justification to you of the concept?

Ah, well, i take a more scientific approach:
i conceive a theory,
& do not believe my observations show anything conclusively,
except, perhaps, that my theory's been disproven.

a people without terms for numbers doesn't develop the ability to determine exact numbers

In th article, i find nothing to refute this theory, agreed.
However, th same data also fails to disprove my own theory, to wit:
a ppl who have no need to determine exact numbers
don't bother inventing words to describe them,
& may not even bother conditioning into their neurons th ability to recognise them.
A Pirahã mother doesn't ask her child to gather ten nuts,
just some nuts, or mebbe a heapa nuts, a few nuts, or a nut.
Aside from differentiatin unity and various scales of plurality,
th culture has no need of number.
If a specific number is needed, it's for a specific reason,
and can be communicated in reference to that reason,
eg: "get a nut for each person coming to dinner",
th child repeats their names while collectin nuts,
& voila, returns with th exact number of nuts.
Just as we'r amazed by their inability to even conceive of exact numbers,
they'd be equally exasperated by our inability to recognise tiny diffrences in plants,
or follow animal tracks etc. Aniwaze...

the ancient western Celts, who had a concept for a colour

Hmm, does this example refute my theory?
I imagine their word for this concept derived from a phrase that meant "sea-colourd".
What with words being th wonderful abstracters that they are,
after many generations it'd be reduced to sumpt like "secol",
so ppl might even forget th specific origin of th more general concept
and be heard to remark that, "th sea is secol colourd."
Th important point here is that th word grew upon th concept, not vice versa.
Let's consider th even more general concept of colour.
Mammals (among other organisms) were observing, reacting to, makin use of colours
long before humans were able to conceive of it as a general pattern.
And i'm sure there was a gap between this awareness
and th invention of a word to label it.
What drove this invention was th need to communicate th concept to others,
which is why i referrd to language as a mind to mind transmission codec.

Consciousness, as the etymology of the word indicates

Hmm, yes, well "fantasy" and "fancy" were once th same word,
and meant something more like a vision or hallucination.
What do ppl mean by consciousness these days?
Despite th existence of th word,
th concept still seems rather muddy.

words both free and trap us (part 2)

[decrypt-era.livejournal.com]

You are a lover of words, eh?
I'd'v enjoyd seeing you in Timor, bereft of verbal facility!
Readin your replies to amazinggoatgirl,
i can see that definitions'll be important here,
so before my p-consciousness gets overwhelmd with philosophic jargon,
i'l jump right in with my own personal definitions of a few words.

My definition of "thought" is broader than most ppl's:
my thoughts are any information processing done by me,
mostly by my nervous system,
but also by all of th other particles in my body,
and certain other particles in my environment which aid me in this task.
My brain is essentially a pattern matching organ,
and when an association is made between any two patterns,
i'd say that is th basic unit of "concept",
tho most of the concepts we'r aware of
consist of much larger, more complex groups of such associations.

My definition of "consciousness" is much narrower than most ppl's:
it is th part of th brain which makes up a story
about why th rest of th brain did what it just did.
This is very important to us,
as it allows us to connect past, present & future,
to model time,
and this ability has set humans apart,
transferrd our evolution from a genetic to a memetic timescale.
But i do believe consciousness has become vastly over-rated, by itself.
It's come to believe it's in charge, and bullies th rest of th mind,
or even to live in denial, and believe itself the entirety of our mind,
while simultaneously fearing that dark majority it calls "subconscious",
because, in fact, consciousness entirely dependant upon it.
This schism is reflectd in our culture.

Now, contrary to th current fashion,
i don't think of this blurry-edged eliminative process calld consciousness
as identical to th sensation of awareness, being, experience, what have you.
This i refer to as th "observer",
and i believe it's a much more primal thing.
Every quantum-level interaction, every collapse of th wave function,
is an act of observation.
Consciousness simply fabricates the illusion
that th quadrillions of observations which make up our "self"
are but a single thread.

Now, i don't expect you to switch to my definitions, of course,
i'm just hoping to explore th concepts behind th words,
to which end i'v attemptd to give greater depth to my representations,
get closer to th territory being mapped.
It's not a question of right or wrong,
i'm just curious to know why you say "thought = words",
when, in my experience, i do a great deal of thinking
that does not involve words at all,
like when i'm drawing, for example.

And you are a busy fellow,
so please, take your time in replying -
i'v always preferrd your thoughts to your words. ;P